Saturn 3 Door Coupes SC1 and SC2

Crank but no start

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  #61  
Old 03-22-2020, 09:16 AM
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Passlock II operation does not kill the fuel pump, only the injectors.

​​​​​To confirm: no V to the FPump FUSE, either terminal, relative to chassis ground, fuse removed, dc voltage? Is that under the hood or in the inside fuse panel?

The fuses for these types of components is usually fused right off the battery feed to the fuse box or the inst panrl junc box. But there are exceptions.

The relay closure to enable the pump is pretty standard. It seems to be that two things are goofy. No v at the fuel pump AND no v to trigger the relay. I don't think they are on the same circuit but I will try to guestimate.

Let me go dig at 2nd gen schematics. They may not be correct but it is better than nothing for now
 
  #62  
Old 03-22-2020, 09:20 AM
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Never answered your rephrased question. I am with rube about trying a junkyard BCM, now it sounds like you have an additional issue with current getting to the fuel pump. If there is no voltage at the fuse, you may be looking at a burnt terminal on the backside of the fuse panel. This is not all that uncommon for the S cars but not all that common either.

I think you can search online through carid.com to see if someone has the correct part. I can help you with the part number if you need me to. And again we probably won't find one that matches exactly we just need to find one that matches enough. What is the mileage readout on the dash when the key is in the on position?
 
  #63  
Old 03-22-2020, 09:39 AM
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Was is the DC V drop on the high side of the IP batt fuse socket, fuse removed to chassis ground on the ipjb inside the car? 30 A fuse, should be hot at all times......

Make 200% sure your ground is a chassis ground or you will end up measuring 0 v for everything.
 

Last edited by derf; 03-22-2020 at 09:41 AM.
  #64  
Old 03-22-2020, 09:57 AM
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Sorry for the inefficient posting.

The relevant current path seems to be

IP batt fuse>>fp relay>>fuel pump fuse>>fuel pump>>ground

So if you have no v rel to chassis ground at any fp relay terminal, then the relay is not getting any V I from the upstream ip batt connection distribution point.

Which means one of two things. Wiring issue on the underside of the inner fuse panel where the IP batt feed branches off, or bad wiring at the relay socket on the same ipjb.

 
  #65  
Old 03-22-2020, 12:39 PM
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Ok as usual I'm way behind....I'll work on those issues in awhile and get back today. Right now I need some relief, thankfully liquor stores are considered 'essential business'
 
  #66  
Old 03-22-2020, 02:09 PM
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After a few pops and reading closely your suggestions, here's my thinking at the moment. Junkyard is out, I need to be sure the part is 100% tested before installation. I don't have the skills to trace I and V across relays. Tomorrow I'll call these guys VeTech Auto who are highly recommended and see what they would charge to debug/narrow down this situation. The plus is I can pull the car out of the garage with a rope, have them work on it and with their help push it back in - I can't work on the car in the driveway without being 'fined' by the Association.

As always appreciate the assist and will update tomorrow.
 
  #67  
Old 03-22-2020, 09:28 PM
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No, the BCM to swap in at does not need to be one hundred percent tested. It just needs to act differently than the one you have. This is a narrow down step, not a permanent replacement although it could become one if the car runs.

These folks will charge you a hefty fee to tell you you should replace the BCM. We're telling you to look for a difference in behavior . If you're lucky it runs the car. $20 risk.

Is the key loose in the ignition?

Your issue with a solid security light in a 3rd generation S car is the only one ever on this forum. Which is why we're past 60 posts with no solution.

Take the fuse panel off from the ipjb. I believe it's 2 bolts. Look at the back of the relay socket for the f p.

You know how to look for 12V at the IP batt fuse terminals. Wiring is the simplest answer to the fuel pump.

Don't give in yet

 
  #68  
Old 03-23-2020, 09:39 AM
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Ok.....I hear you loud and clear. Here's my today plan. I need to get this car out of garage so I can open the passenger door. It's facing forward which is not good. I'm going to call the tow guy and have him get it out and turn it around so it's facing the garage. Then I can work on it discreetly in the driveway so I don't get fined by the Association.

I'll call around to junk yards and see if I can get a BCM and will keep you posted, thanks.

 
  #69  
Old 03-23-2020, 09:51 AM
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Yes there is a little bit of play with the key in the ignition switch.
 
  #70  
Old 03-24-2020, 12:56 PM
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The cars in the driveway facing the garage, yea! Had to call the tow guy. Instead of pulling the ipjb to check on problems at the FP fuse I removed the panel on the driver side and have a good view of the rear panel, much easier. All looks fine, nothing out of order, did spray with CRC contact cleaner.

Checked under hood IP Batt V for the Nth time and it's 12+V. Next is to source a BCM from a junkyard. Maybe an ECM too. I'll keep you posted

Thanks......
 


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