When you click on links to various merchants on this site and make a purchase, this can result in this site earning a commission. Affiliate programs and affiliations include, but are not limited to, the eBay Partner Network.
Trying to troubleshoot electrical issues, including misfires, is a no-no with a bad battery. If your battery cannot hold a charge then either the alternator is not doing its job or The battery needs to be replaced. It is critical that sufficient current get to the control modules throughout the vehicle. if the battery cannot supply enough current at the correct voltages, you basically have no idea what to expect. I would suggest that you replace your battery, even if it is a cheapy not gonna last from AutoZone.
At being said, upstream sensor means the sensor right off the exhaust manifold. Downstream sensor means after the catalytic converter. If this vehicle has a pre cat right at the exhaust manifold exit, then the upstream will be after the pre-cat but in front of the main cat.
Here is a link to RockAuto for the corresponding parts.
Upstream bank one sensor one and bank two sensor two
2000 LS 3.0 v6 sensor one bank one and sensor one bank two
-----------
Note its location is at each exhaust manifold.
Per the descriptions of parts at different GM wholesale parts distributors, there is also an oxygen sensor located in the exhaust piping between the exhaust manifold and the main catalytic converter. One on each of the two pipes leading from each of the exhaust manifolds. The pipes come together just ahead of the catalytic converter so there is only one downstream O2 sensor at the output of the single cat. I have seen this referred to as at exhaust pipe in most descriptions. I am honestly not sure what the references are for correctly referencing the oxygen sensors located in the pipes. They are seemingly the ones listed as front.
---------
Andy, a little help please? Don't want to mislead this gentleman. I've never driven v6 in my life let alone worked on a v6 Saturn, let alone one with pre-cats which I believe this has as the s cars from '98 on had pre-cats and I've never worked on one of those either.
Trying to troubleshoot electrical issues, including misfires, is a no-no with a bad battery. If your battery cannot hold a charge then either the alternator is not doing its job or The battery needs to be replaced. It is critical that sufficient current get to the control modules throughout the vehicle. if the battery cannot supply enough current at the correct voltages, you basically have no idea what to expect. I would suggest that you replace your battery, even if it is a cheapy not gonna last from AutoZone.
At being said, upstream sensor means the sensor right off the exhaust manifold. Downstream sensor means after the catalytic converter. If this vehicle has a pre cat right at the exhaust manifold exit, then the upstream will be after the pre-cat but in front of the main cat.
Here is a link to RockAuto for the corresponding parts.
Upstream bank one sensor one and bank two sensor two
2000 LS 3.0 v6 sensor one bank one and sensor one bank two
-----------
Note its location is at each exhaust manifold.
Per the descriptions of parts at different GM wholesale parts distributors, there is also an oxygen sensor located in the exhaust piping between the exhaust manifold and the main catalytic converter. One on each of the two pipes leading from each of the exhaust manifolds. The pipes come together just ahead of the catalytic converter so there is only one downstream O2 sensor at the output of the single cat. I have seen this referred to as at exhaust pipe in most descriptions. I am honestly not sure what the references are for correctly referencing the oxygen sensors located in the pipes. They are seemingly the ones listed as front.
---------
Andy, a little help please? Don't want to mislead this gentleman. I've never driven v6 in my life let alone worked on a v6 Saturn, let alone one with pre-cats which I believe this has as the s cars from '98 on had pre-cats and I've never worked on one of those either.
The V-6 has (4) oxygen sensors. It has a "pre cat" in each exhaust pipe off the manifold and a "main cat" after the two pipes converge.
The Bank 1,sensor 1 and Bank 2 sensor 1 are identical. They are before the 'pre cats"
Bank 1 sensor 2, and Bank 2 sensor 2 are different in that the wiring harness are different lengths.
They are after the "pre cats " and before the "main cat"
I appreciate the lecture on source voltage in testing sensors. It is my first and foremost thought as well. Our Saturn has not been driven in over 2 months. The battery has been ran down to dead twice in that amount of time. I only have a 1 amp charger, hence why I am giving it a few days to charge before I continue working on the vehicle. The engine has only ran maybe all up 5 minutes total in the last 2 months... hardly enough to maintain a charge on the battery. The battery is at mid-life and it does hold a charge... without charging it. The alternator is putting out 14.4 volts
I was a bit confused to learn the code reader I purchased does not do as advertised. Ancel 420. It states it does evap testing, it does not. It stated it can test CO2 sensors, it does not. What it does do is an inquiry to read the last known good operational inputs stored by the engine manager concerning each CO2 sensor. So when I pulled the code for bad Bank 2 Sensor 1 sensor, I then ran the CO2 test and B2, S1 sensor apparently passed! Now if that doesn't screw up the garage mechanic... Arrrgggg!!! It is true it can read live data from the O2 sensors, but I never got that far because as I sat there for an hour screwing around with the Ancel 420 to learn how to use it... the battery ran down and could not start the vehicle.
When the ignition key is switched to ON without running the engine, there is a substantial and sustained draw on the battery. I've seen a single dome light run a Saturn battery dead the next morning. These batteries can supply many cranking amps, but if the voltage is low... the starter can not spin/engage. It needs a good healthy 12 volts and several hundred amps to get going and overcome the engine's static condition
Okay, the O2 Sensor made no difference. I had bought it before I read the various responses. When the new code reader says it's bad... I believed it. Now I get codes that both Bank 2 Sensor 1 and Bank 1 Sensor 2 are bad. The engine chokes like an eighty year old cigar smoker at an idle, back firing etc... At 1.5 K RPMs it runs smooth as silk. It seems to be loading up at idle and choking itself or it is struggling to get gas. Too many potential iterations! I can imagine about a dozen potential faults and I'm not spending another dime on this car!
I've fixed so many things on this Saturn and I am really done with replacing parts. I have replaced the sub-frame two winters ago, Struts all around, all brakes/rotors. new tires, new muffler, and so much more. We bought this vehicle new in 2000 and it has been a great very fun vehicle, but now it seems haunted. We bought a new vehicle and I think I am really ready to call the junk yard and say come get it!
FYI A few years ago, the timing belt tensioner went bad and the timing went off by one tooth. I was ready to junk the car then, but my wife loved her car so I fixed it. However, I really don't know if piston met valve vs vs. Nevertheless, it ran excellent for many 1,000's of miles and then started to puke oil like a sinking tanker. I embarked into changing the valve cover gaskets and hatred the entire process in our single car apartment garage. The thread I Blew it UP describes more details.
Hindsight is 2020... I should have junked the Saturn before investing in so many fixes. I estimated the old girl needed $ 7,400 worth of repairs. We were getting close to having everything done! I think we spent about 3K as I did all the work myself.
Maybe I should blame it on Covid because I got so sick immediately after I took the engine apart and had to leave it sit for 10 days until I recovered. Just long enough to forget how to put it back together again! I don't know if I had covid, but I and my wife were sicker than we had ever been and this was before covid came to America! So we were told! It was mid Feb.
Maybe I'll pull the Bank 2 plugs and take a look in the cylinders. I finally bought a bore scope... might as well use it!
I am waiting for the weather to improve so I can perform more inspections. I received an endoscope to inspect the pistons, valves and cylinder walls. I'm waiting on a compression test kit.
My current need is to fine complete wiring diagram of the engine. I am looking for pinouts, wire colors and most importantly all grounding connections. I can't find a pinout/wire colors for a Bosch 16066 O2 sensor. Evidently, it is not just a simple O2 sensor. It is a bit more fancy with 5 wires. I plan to verify all wire functions and trace all connections to determine faults, but I need a schematic to work off of. Does anyone have legible schematics? I suspect I lost a ground connection somewhere and that is causing errors with the O2 sensors hence the engine is running blindly i.e. very badly at idle.
This ****ty weather has got to improve... right? LOL 40mph winds, rain... Hey, it's spring already!
04-22-2020, 06:52 AM
