my gf has 1999 saturn with about 170K and we knew it needed some stuff like brakes for inspection but turns out the check engine code is supposedly for the EGR valve.

my mechanic is not cheap but he's honest and straight up.

he said he gets them from the dealer so its about 300 bucks then about 150 more for installing and i guess the time to drive the car to clear out the code or run it or whatever they have to do to pass emissions

he said that he may take off the EGR and it really not need it but the code usually is right. so i have a decision to make. i can get the generic EGR right now locally for about 77 bucks. i didnt look where it is on her car but ill assume its not too hard to install. (any advice is appreciated). i've done it on the 95 SS before and it was at the rear of the v8 and not a lot of fun but not the end of the world)

if this doesnt work i realize they wont take the EGR back and we are out 77. but then my question will be what else is causing the CEL to stay on. do you know what would throw an EGR code if not the EGR? he said it is that most of the time

so i dont know what to do. let him fix it for 450 or maybe it wont even take it but if it does work, then we are out 450. if we replace it for 77 and it doesnt work. i guess that means his 450 wouldnt be necessary and he would have to do further diagnostic work. he admitted he didnt want to run up the bill today with further diagnostic

she really doesnt want to look for another car so we were gonna install the front brakes and rotors and fix the muffler hanger and let him do the outer tie rod and alignment. he said if we did that work her bill would be about 700 to 800 to make it legal and we have till june 30 for inspection so this decision needs to be made asap. i just dont know enough about the EGR etc to know if the code really is the code and that is that. or the EGR code could be something else?

also it is burning oil but i'm unsure how much.

thanks

 

Before going any further

Please provide the diagnostic code for the EGR -- there are several.
Please provide the code as Pxxxx where the x's are numbers.
We'll then look up the exact code and figure out what to do.

Most EGR valves on the S Cars can be cleaned, but 170K is a long time for carbon to build up in there so it may be hard to clean.

Need the Pxxxx code first, please. If you have car, you can go to any Autozone, Advance etc chain store and they will read the codes for free.

 

You need to find another mechanic. That guy is a con artist. Check this out, is why I'm saying that. Now, I don't know if yours is an SC, SL or SW, but don't really see how that's relevant unless the EGR is different on all of them. https://www.saturnparts.com/catalogs.html

 

actually that proves he's in the ballpark and I've been going to him over 15 years and he's saved me tons of money. doing stuff free even. plus I do most of my own repairs and he's even helped me out and given me back my own car and said put brakes on that and come back and see me. he knows he will get some of my business in the end


that site you posted listed EGR:


List Price : $290.08
Your Price : $184.20


he would definitely charge list (id think any garage has to in order to make money) and doesn't use aftermarket. my plan is use the autozone one they have in stock for 77.


my plan tonight is get the code and then take it off and see if it needs obvious cleaning and spray it. maybe that would be enough if I got lucky?


do I need to reset the code with my autoxray 7000 or does the car reset itself if the problem is solved. and lets say I do clear the code manually. how far do I need to drive it to get it to settle in to be sure the code isn't there anymore.

 

3 codes. wonder why he didn't mention the other 2


p0404 p0327 p1599


I never did any knock sensor work and she said she just stalled it recently so that's probably the 1599


I cleaned EGR up a bit. this is how it looked before cleanup. also started it to blow out stuff. then took some pics of other stuff I have no clue what it all means


I can get you more stuff if you need off the computer


so do I drive it with the cleaned up EGR and let it reset or clear codes with my machine?

 

P0404 EGR Circuit Range/Performance

That is one filthy EGR. as are the ports that lead to and from it.
Clean as directed but be sure NOT to bend the pintle


Cleaning the ports it at attaches to seems to have already been done.

Please post pics of the cleaned EGR and ports where it attaches.

-----------
P0327 Knock Sensor Bank 1 Low Input

Sounds like knock sensor is not sending an acceptably high signal to the PCM.
This often means either
1)the sensor is not getting its 5V (I think) feed from the PCM
2)there is a wiring problem somewhere between the knock sensor and he PCM (wiring harness, wiring, etc...a break in the continuity of the circuit.
3)knock sensor is defective.

Find the knock sensor on your vehicle and ensure everything is connected, then.....

---------
P1599 Engine Stall or Near Stall Detected

So highly informational. Ignore.
__________________________

EGR -- you've cleaned. Pintle must move up and down freely without sticking
Knock Sensor -- investigation required

Clearing Codes
-----------------

Most of your other I/M inspection readiness tests have already been run and probably passed. Use your scanner to read the status of your I/M monitors.
Unless you have previously cleared codes recently, they should all be "ready" except EGR and possibly "comprehensive" for the knock sensor.

You don't want to clear codes this close to the inspection deadline if the majority of thee monitors already indicate "ready".

The EGR will take at least 50 mi to decide if it is working properly. Check to see if you can get the EGR to "ready" state

 

TY for the info and video. I cant get to the car until sunday but ill clean per video.


then I wont clear the code but i'm tempted to because to me that's the only way I can be sure it wont come back. once we put on new brakes sunday the car will be driveable again and gf will drive it to work every day. earliest I can get inspection is Friday. she drives at least 30 miles a day.


what i'm asking is how do I know we have driven 'enough' if I don't reset the codes?


the knock sensor sounds beyond my abilities. so ill just have to pay the garage to do it. but maybe I can try to at least give a look

 

The check engine light will go out after three drive cycles if the code is not detected, but it takes ten drive cycles for the code to disappear and the ready light to come on.

If you reset the MIL, then drive for about 20 minutes between 45 and 65 mph. all the monitors should run and you should be able to pass the smog check. If they don't, then something else is wrong.

 

Quite intrigued by this one, Keith.

Bearing in mind I am NOT on the attack....

1)If as you state the car's PCM convinces itself after 3 drive cycles that the condition causing the illumination of the CEL/SES (EGR in this case) is no longer present and has not returned, the CEL/SES is turned off by the PCM. This would imply that no hard or pending codes exist. If no hard or pending codes exist and the diag for the EGR has been run and met criteria, why wouldn't the PCM believe itself and set the EGR monitor to ready?

2) Why an extra 7 drive cycles to become "ready"?
3) In fact, why 3 drive cycles to turn off the CEL/SES?
4) Why does it only require 1 drive cycle to indicate the EGR is "ready" after you go in and wipe everything out?

Certainly it becomes a historical code and may take many drive cycles to push it out of the current memory storage area, but I don't see how historical codes have anything to do with readiness indication.

What is the source of the above information?

It seems rather backwards that it would be easier to repair a problem and purposely wipe the slate clean and make only 1 drive cycle necessary for each monitor

vs

repairing the problem, letting the PCM rerun the EGR diag once (which is not a continuous diag), and having everything deemed in spec and ready without any monkeying with a code eraser.....If one good EGR diag from 1 drive cycle is good enough following a full monitor wipe, why 3 or 10 required by a mechanical-only fix.................................

 

well the pintle was indeed frozen. glad I watched the video. I soaked it and sprayed,. worked until dark cause put new brakes on too. fun times all around. we are taking it on at least 30 mile drive tomorrow doing stuff so hopefully the code clears for the EGR


i'm assuming stuck pintle would throw the code? maybe we got lucky!