Suspected crankcase position sensor failure
Super Moderator
Joined: Jul 2005
Posts: 12,316
From: Slightly off center
The high idle at start could be caused by a defective ECTS, The coolant temperature sensor in the head, though the fact that the idle finds its way down near where it should be kind of leans away from that. Indeed I would go after the throttle body first. Don't just replace the IAC, just clean the passage to it very thoroughly. Be sure to use throttle body cleaner and not carb and choke cleaner, as the letter will dissolve away the coating on the inside of the throttle body. Do things one at a time meaning clean the throttle body, Then try. Then do the EGR.
When you do the EGR, use carb and choke cleaner. Let it soak for a good hour filled with cleaner. The pintle should move freely up and down. It should also rotate freely. If I remember correctly, the end of the pintle is a torx. Don't beat the crap out of it moving it in and out how's you do not want to change the rest position of the pintle from what it currently is. When it is commanded open or closed, sensors in the top of the valve monitor if it is moved the proper amount as well as how long it takes to get there. If you change the rest position, that gets all screwed up.
You also want to spray into both the pipe leading to and from the EGR valve. One of these is essentially raw exhaust. Don't spray an entire can in them but let it run down and soak. Otherwise it will just work its way back up to the valve.
The next part is louder than ****. Wear hearing protection. Secure a rag 2 the pipe leading to the EGR. Make sure it is not laying over the other pipe and that it is not laying in front of the throttle body opening as you don't want it getting sucked in.
When you start the engine, all kinds of disgusting goo will leave the covered tube projectile style.. in every direction. Hence the rag. If you don't use the rag then you have the jewelry of cleaning all that muck from all over the engine bay, possibly the underside of the hood and depending on how far it shoots, the wall.
Before you start all this, be sure you have a spare EGR gasket which is still available for purchase.
Don't forget to put the electrical connector back on when you're done.
Now to the CKP. If you can, take your spark plug removal setup with you on your friendly neighborhood drive. Hopefully it will die. Bring a friend. As soon as it dies, hop out, properly remove a spark plug wire, and remove a spark plug.
Reattach the spark plug wire to the plug, then ground the end electrode do something metal under the hood that is neither painted nor rusted.
Have your friend crank the engine long enough for you to see whether or not there is spark in the plug gap. After you determine yes or no, put down the plug and wire and sniff inside the spark plug hole where you removed the plug. If the CKP is bad you will not smell fuel.
Replace the spark plug. Do not cross thread it and do not overtighten it as the head is aluminum and you do not want to **** this up.
If you have neither spark nor fuel, the CKP is bad.
There is also an acceptable resistance range that you can measure with the sensor installed in the car or not. It's a pain in the *** to get a multimeter on the CKP pins while it's installed so just remove the bolt and take the damn thing out and measure the resistance. I can look it up or you can look it up online. I believe it should be something like 500 to 700 ohms but that may be incorrect.
I've intentionally not try to lead you in any direction, because you are one of the few people that join the form that actually think about what's going on with your vehicle and actively participate in troubleshooting.
The puzzling part is the RPM oscillations with the vehicle still in gear. I have had this happen to me once and only once when driving my 97 SC2. I was decelerating and the RPMs started to gyrate, the gas pedal affected nothing, and the car basically rolled into a toll booth window just as it stalled. I paid my toll but the car would not start for about 10 minutes. My mechanic at the time told me that in rare circumstances, if the EGR gets stuck, I don't remember right now whether open or closed, it creates a condition where there is excess back pressure which stops the proper flow of air and fuel, screwing up combustion and the car sporadically fires until it stalls. It won't start again until that pressure bleeds off.
I would not expect a CKP failure to create that type of gyration in RPM. If it did, you would hear the engine firing, then not for who knows how long, then firing. I suppose it's possible, but anything is possible. Not saying it can't happen, but it would be a very unique failure and we would have to name it after you.
The static resistance test and the I have no spark and no fuel in the cylinders by the side of the road test together will confirm CKP failure. The static resistance test alone may be enough to justify changing it. We preach no shotgunning of farts or parts and you seem to be of like mind which makes all this much easier.
Do you have any SES codes now?
For the record, these cars never throw CKP codes. I've seen it once in about 15 years.
When you do the EGR, use carb and choke cleaner. Let it soak for a good hour filled with cleaner. The pintle should move freely up and down. It should also rotate freely. If I remember correctly, the end of the pintle is a torx. Don't beat the crap out of it moving it in and out how's you do not want to change the rest position of the pintle from what it currently is. When it is commanded open or closed, sensors in the top of the valve monitor if it is moved the proper amount as well as how long it takes to get there. If you change the rest position, that gets all screwed up.
You also want to spray into both the pipe leading to and from the EGR valve. One of these is essentially raw exhaust. Don't spray an entire can in them but let it run down and soak. Otherwise it will just work its way back up to the valve.
The next part is louder than ****. Wear hearing protection. Secure a rag 2 the pipe leading to the EGR. Make sure it is not laying over the other pipe and that it is not laying in front of the throttle body opening as you don't want it getting sucked in.
When you start the engine, all kinds of disgusting goo will leave the covered tube projectile style.. in every direction. Hence the rag. If you don't use the rag then you have the jewelry of cleaning all that muck from all over the engine bay, possibly the underside of the hood and depending on how far it shoots, the wall.
Before you start all this, be sure you have a spare EGR gasket which is still available for purchase.
Don't forget to put the electrical connector back on when you're done.
Now to the CKP. If you can, take your spark plug removal setup with you on your friendly neighborhood drive. Hopefully it will die. Bring a friend. As soon as it dies, hop out, properly remove a spark plug wire, and remove a spark plug.
Reattach the spark plug wire to the plug, then ground the end electrode do something metal under the hood that is neither painted nor rusted.
Have your friend crank the engine long enough for you to see whether or not there is spark in the plug gap. After you determine yes or no, put down the plug and wire and sniff inside the spark plug hole where you removed the plug. If the CKP is bad you will not smell fuel.
Replace the spark plug. Do not cross thread it and do not overtighten it as the head is aluminum and you do not want to **** this up.
If you have neither spark nor fuel, the CKP is bad.
There is also an acceptable resistance range that you can measure with the sensor installed in the car or not. It's a pain in the *** to get a multimeter on the CKP pins while it's installed so just remove the bolt and take the damn thing out and measure the resistance. I can look it up or you can look it up online. I believe it should be something like 500 to 700 ohms but that may be incorrect.
I've intentionally not try to lead you in any direction, because you are one of the few people that join the form that actually think about what's going on with your vehicle and actively participate in troubleshooting.
The puzzling part is the RPM oscillations with the vehicle still in gear. I have had this happen to me once and only once when driving my 97 SC2. I was decelerating and the RPMs started to gyrate, the gas pedal affected nothing, and the car basically rolled into a toll booth window just as it stalled. I paid my toll but the car would not start for about 10 minutes. My mechanic at the time told me that in rare circumstances, if the EGR gets stuck, I don't remember right now whether open or closed, it creates a condition where there is excess back pressure which stops the proper flow of air and fuel, screwing up combustion and the car sporadically fires until it stalls. It won't start again until that pressure bleeds off.
I would not expect a CKP failure to create that type of gyration in RPM. If it did, you would hear the engine firing, then not for who knows how long, then firing. I suppose it's possible, but anything is possible. Not saying it can't happen, but it would be a very unique failure and we would have to name it after you.
The static resistance test and the I have no spark and no fuel in the cylinders by the side of the road test together will confirm CKP failure. The static resistance test alone may be enough to justify changing it. We preach no shotgunning of farts or parts and you seem to be of like mind which makes all this much easier.
Do you have any SES codes now?
For the record, these cars never throw CKP codes. I've seen it once in about 15 years.
Thread Starter
|
Junior Member
Joined: Apr 2023
Posts: 17
The high idle at start could be caused by a defective ECTS, The coolant temperature sensor in the head, though the fact that the idle finds its way down near where it should be kind of leans away from that. Indeed I would go after the throttle body first. Don't just replace the IAC, just clean the passage to it very thoroughly. Be sure to use throttle body cleaner and not carb and choke cleaner, as the latter will dissolve away the coating on the inside of the throttle body. Oops, I already sprayed the IAC, it's port, and throttle body not removed with carb cleaner. (removed IAC only) Doing that improved the idle problem only slightly.Do things one at a time meaning clean the throttle body, Then try. Then do the EGR. I had to reorder the parts ordered a week ago. Not Rockauto's fault. My plan is still to purchase throttle body cleaner and carb cleaner and use appropriately. If it's not too late? My bet is it's $10.00 or more by now and will be good for less than a year once used. I ordered gaskets for the throttle body and the EGR whether they end up being needed or not. Time spent to clean the oem parts first and individually is time well spent now more than ever. These days replacing OEM parts for remakes, especially Chinese ones, should be avoided at all cost. Me, I still believe in ACDelco over buying the cheapest part available. In doing that there can still be cons though. Currently an IAC on rockauto runs $100.79 - $8.79. With the two ACDelco versions being the highest at $100.79, & $44.99. I read that as an"if you're willing to pay that much, then here you go". In this case and because the IAC is semi easy to get at. I went with a Walker version for $26.97.
This is a classic learning through shared experiences, so please. Anyone, & everyone please feel free to state their opinion on the best parts to use.
As for the CKP not CPS I went with the ACDelco version. Biggest quandary there being should I remove the starter to get at it? That's what I intend to do and I will want to replace the highest of the two starter bolts with a stud and lock nut.
I did read an intake stud can be used and I will see how that goes once I'm back in it again.
When you do the EGR, use carb and choke cleaner. Let it soak for a good hour filled with cleaner. The pintle should move freely up and down. It should also rotate freely. If I remember correctly, the end of the pintle is a torx. Don't beat the crap out of it moving it in and out how's you do not want to change the rest position of the pintle from what it currently is. When it is commanded open or closed, sensors in the top of the valve monitor if it is moved the proper amount as well as how long it takes to get there. If you change the rest position, that gets all screwed up.
You also want to spray into both the pipe leading to and from the EGR valve. One of these is essentially raw exhaust. Don't spray an entire can in them but let it run down and soak. Otherwise it will just work its way back up to the valve.
The next part is louder than ****. Wear hearing protection. Secure a rag 2 the pipe leading to the EGR. Make sure it is not laying over the other pipe and that it is not laying in front of the throttle body opening as you don't want it getting sucked in.
When you start the engine, all kinds of disgusting goo will leave the covered tube projectile style.. Love it. I'll have to look at the EGR and read through this again to make sure I do that right. Thanks for the idea.
Now to the CKP. If you can, take your spark plug removal setup with you on your friendly neighborhood drive. Hopefully it will die. Bring a friend. As soon as it dies, hop out, properly remove a spark plug wire, and remove a spark plug. Big mistake on my part here. I have an in line spark indicator tool but I've already missed the prime test opportunity for that one. Only good being I do have a newfound respect for how the car is getting such good gas mileage. These push as easy as you could possibly expect.
If you have neither spark nor fuel, the CKP is bad.
There is also an acceptable resistance range that you can measure with the sensor installed in the car or not. It's a pain in the *** to get a multimeter on the CKP pins while it's installed so just remove the bolt and take the damn thing out and measure the resistance. I can look it up or you can look it up online. I believe it should be something like 500 to 700 ohms but that may be incorrect. I will check the ohms resistance but that will be more for possible peace of mind. I realize covering all possibilities is the only way to regain the feeling that the car will not drop it's pants in traffic and mine along with it. Still, I've seen enough through these two failures to go ahead and order the CKP not CPS. The main reason I'm so "all in" on CKP failure being the culprit is my first hand view of the tach failure. Imagine any Saturn revving at 2K and turning the key off. That is the type of needle move a saw coming down from 4K. Yes it did go back up to a 3.5K read from approx 2k at least one time for sure. But I can't honestly say I'm sure I saw it increase back up more than once. Don't get me wrong, I'm fine with calling it The Earl Of Crankcase's High Speed CKP Failure if it ends up to be the case.
Review of said failure: 30 miles in on a 60 mile drive. RPM drops at highway speed like it was turned off but comes back to reading correctly to what the engine still in gear is turning for another 1 or 2 hundred yards. The car then ends up on the shoulder unable to restart within a mile from doing approx 80mph. Then 15 - 20 minutes later it started and failed again on take off. Then started again but was turned off (police & wrecker) a total of 50 minutes from initial failure. Then it was towed to where it was started, driven, and parked with the 1st sign of an increased rpm problem 3 hours after initial failure. Then the following 2 days after it was driven less than a quarter mile 3 times on separate occasions with no failings other than high rpm at start. Then it was driven for approx 5 miles that included full throttle and 5th gear operation with a duration of less than 5 minutes where it failed with the same rpm drop and inability to be restarted. Then two hours after that. It started and was run for a minute or so and was turned off with the key with the only problem being the same increased rpm idle as after being towed from the initial failure.
I've intentionally not tried to lead you in any direction.
The puzzling part is the RPM oscillations with the vehicle still in gear. I have had this happen to me once and only once when driving my 97 SC2. I was decelerating and the RPMs started to gyrate, the gas pedal affected nothing, and the car basically rolled into a toll booth window just as it stalled. I paid my toll but the car would not start for about 10 minutes. My mechanic at the time told me that in rare circumstances, if the EGR gets stuck, I don't remember right now whether open or closed, it creates a condition where there is excess back pressure which stops the proper flow of air and fuel, screwing up combustion and the car sporadically fires until it stalls. It won't start again until that pressure bleeds off. Well, It did start and I drove it forward and backward slightly to show the wrecker backing up to it that it was operational. That was right before I turned it off and opted for the free tow off the highway approx an hour after the initialfailure.
I would not expect a CKP failure to create that type of gyration in RPM. If it did, you would hear the engine firing, then not for who knows how long, then firing. I suppose it's possible, but anything is possible. Not saying it can't happen, but it would be a very unique failure and we would have to name it after you.
The static resistance test and the I have no spark and no fuel in the cylinders by the side of the road test together will confirm CKP failure. The static resistance test alone may be enough to justify changing it. We preach no shotgunning of farts or parts and you seem to be of like mind which makes all this much easier.
Do you have any SES codes now? No. No longer shows any codes after battery removal but also after 2nd suspected CKP failure.
The EGR, IAC, and throttle body are the easiest to get at so that's 1st on the list.
Replacing the CKP is a nasty repair but at $28.00 the main thing to avoid there is trading out a good OEM part for an aftermarket maypop. My plan is to clean the EGR and swap the IAC since it's already been replaced before. Then I'll take it on another test drive. Ohms on a good CKP suspected to be .785
This is a classic learning through shared experiences, so please. Anyone, & everyone please feel free to state their opinion on the best parts to use.
As for the CKP not CPS I went with the ACDelco version. Biggest quandary there being should I remove the starter to get at it? That's what I intend to do and I will want to replace the highest of the two starter bolts with a stud and lock nut.
I did read an intake stud can be used and I will see how that goes once I'm back in it again.
When you do the EGR, use carb and choke cleaner. Let it soak for a good hour filled with cleaner. The pintle should move freely up and down. It should also rotate freely. If I remember correctly, the end of the pintle is a torx. Don't beat the crap out of it moving it in and out how's you do not want to change the rest position of the pintle from what it currently is. When it is commanded open or closed, sensors in the top of the valve monitor if it is moved the proper amount as well as how long it takes to get there. If you change the rest position, that gets all screwed up.
You also want to spray into both the pipe leading to and from the EGR valve. One of these is essentially raw exhaust. Don't spray an entire can in them but let it run down and soak. Otherwise it will just work its way back up to the valve.
The next part is louder than ****. Wear hearing protection. Secure a rag 2 the pipe leading to the EGR. Make sure it is not laying over the other pipe and that it is not laying in front of the throttle body opening as you don't want it getting sucked in.
When you start the engine, all kinds of disgusting goo will leave the covered tube projectile style.. Love it. I'll have to look at the EGR and read through this again to make sure I do that right. Thanks for the idea.
Now to the CKP. If you can, take your spark plug removal setup with you on your friendly neighborhood drive. Hopefully it will die. Bring a friend. As soon as it dies, hop out, properly remove a spark plug wire, and remove a spark plug. Big mistake on my part here. I have an in line spark indicator tool but I've already missed the prime test opportunity for that one. Only good being I do have a newfound respect for how the car is getting such good gas mileage. These push as easy as you could possibly expect.
If you have neither spark nor fuel, the CKP is bad.
There is also an acceptable resistance range that you can measure with the sensor installed in the car or not. It's a pain in the *** to get a multimeter on the CKP pins while it's installed so just remove the bolt and take the damn thing out and measure the resistance. I can look it up or you can look it up online. I believe it should be something like 500 to 700 ohms but that may be incorrect. I will check the ohms resistance but that will be more for possible peace of mind. I realize covering all possibilities is the only way to regain the feeling that the car will not drop it's pants in traffic and mine along with it. Still, I've seen enough through these two failures to go ahead and order the CKP not CPS. The main reason I'm so "all in" on CKP failure being the culprit is my first hand view of the tach failure. Imagine any Saturn revving at 2K and turning the key off. That is the type of needle move a saw coming down from 4K. Yes it did go back up to a 3.5K read from approx 2k at least one time for sure. But I can't honestly say I'm sure I saw it increase back up more than once. Don't get me wrong, I'm fine with calling it The Earl Of Crankcase's High Speed CKP Failure if it ends up to be the case.
Review of said failure: 30 miles in on a 60 mile drive. RPM drops at highway speed like it was turned off but comes back to reading correctly to what the engine still in gear is turning for another 1 or 2 hundred yards. The car then ends up on the shoulder unable to restart within a mile from doing approx 80mph. Then 15 - 20 minutes later it started and failed again on take off. Then started again but was turned off (police & wrecker) a total of 50 minutes from initial failure. Then it was towed to where it was started, driven, and parked with the 1st sign of an increased rpm problem 3 hours after initial failure. Then the following 2 days after it was driven less than a quarter mile 3 times on separate occasions with no failings other than high rpm at start. Then it was driven for approx 5 miles that included full throttle and 5th gear operation with a duration of less than 5 minutes where it failed with the same rpm drop and inability to be restarted. Then two hours after that. It started and was run for a minute or so and was turned off with the key with the only problem being the same increased rpm idle as after being towed from the initial failure.
I've intentionally not tried to lead you in any direction.
The puzzling part is the RPM oscillations with the vehicle still in gear. I have had this happen to me once and only once when driving my 97 SC2. I was decelerating and the RPMs started to gyrate, the gas pedal affected nothing, and the car basically rolled into a toll booth window just as it stalled. I paid my toll but the car would not start for about 10 minutes. My mechanic at the time told me that in rare circumstances, if the EGR gets stuck, I don't remember right now whether open or closed, it creates a condition where there is excess back pressure which stops the proper flow of air and fuel, screwing up combustion and the car sporadically fires until it stalls. It won't start again until that pressure bleeds off. Well, It did start and I drove it forward and backward slightly to show the wrecker backing up to it that it was operational. That was right before I turned it off and opted for the free tow off the highway approx an hour after the initialfailure.
I would not expect a CKP failure to create that type of gyration in RPM. If it did, you would hear the engine firing, then not for who knows how long, then firing. I suppose it's possible, but anything is possible. Not saying it can't happen, but it would be a very unique failure and we would have to name it after you.
The static resistance test and the I have no spark and no fuel in the cylinders by the side of the road test together will confirm CKP failure. The static resistance test alone may be enough to justify changing it. We preach no shotgunning of farts or parts and you seem to be of like mind which makes all this much easier.
Do you have any SES codes now? No. No longer shows any codes after battery removal but also after 2nd suspected CKP failure.
The EGR, IAC, and throttle body are the easiest to get at so that's 1st on the list.
Replacing the CKP is a nasty repair but at $28.00 the main thing to avoid there is trading out a good OEM part for an aftermarket maypop. My plan is to clean the EGR and swap the IAC since it's already been replaced before. Then I'll take it on another test drive. Ohms on a good CKP suspected to be .785
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Joined: Jul 2005
Posts: 12,316
From: Slightly off center
Keep in mind that just static CKP resistance can be measured hot or cold. It's to catch it when everything is malfunctions. Unfortunately you can't do that by the side of the road and if it happens in your driveway you do have a chance. Also if it is defective it may read continuous when cold but go open circuit when hot.
I have no problem with going after the CKP. Just remember that some codes take a certain number of key cycles to set. Some are mileage-based. So don't be surprised if something else pops up later.
Also with respect to ACDelco parts:
AC Delco is ACDelco
AC Delco professional Is whoever paid ACDelco the most money the substitute their parts in ACDelco professional boxes. I bought a complete piece of **** thermostat with another brand name on it that came in an AC Delco professional box. I looked up the brand and it is shunned universally deposit sticks closed started to overheat three times in my garage.
Stay away from Walker in general unless it is exhaust related in which case their parts are okay.
Most people on here recommend Napa for electrical parts. Do not buy them at AutoZone or advanced.
I stay away from wix as well. Don't go near the lowest priced parts on RockAuto. This is almost universal advice. I am a 99.8% OEM parts person, especially on a Saturn. Like using only denso oxygen sensors as they were the OEM. You want to see stupid? Put a Bosch front O2 and see how that works for you.
Don't forget you can always back probe the wires from the CKP but that assumes the connector is making good contact.
I have no idea whether I have addressed everything you brought up plus I'm listening to banjo music in an Elks club. Don't even ask.
I have no problem with going after the CKP. Just remember that some codes take a certain number of key cycles to set. Some are mileage-based. So don't be surprised if something else pops up later.
Also with respect to ACDelco parts:
AC Delco is ACDelco
AC Delco professional Is whoever paid ACDelco the most money the substitute their parts in ACDelco professional boxes. I bought a complete piece of **** thermostat with another brand name on it that came in an AC Delco professional box. I looked up the brand and it is shunned universally deposit sticks closed started to overheat three times in my garage.
Stay away from Walker in general unless it is exhaust related in which case their parts are okay.
Most people on here recommend Napa for electrical parts. Do not buy them at AutoZone or advanced.
I stay away from wix as well. Don't go near the lowest priced parts on RockAuto. This is almost universal advice. I am a 99.8% OEM parts person, especially on a Saturn. Like using only denso oxygen sensors as they were the OEM. You want to see stupid? Put a Bosch front O2 and see how that works for you.
Don't forget you can always back probe the wires from the CKP but that assumes the connector is making good contact.
I have no idea whether I have addressed everything you brought up plus I'm listening to banjo music in an Elks club. Don't even ask.
Thread Starter
|
Junior Member
Joined: Apr 2023
Posts: 17
suspected crankcase position sensor failure
Crankshaft position sensor failure confirmed.
All apologies Derf. I never saw your what happened email. Didn't see the other (Not another ungrateful turd?) email either. That's how I would have written it anyway. The reason for no response from this actually grateful turd is I sold our Pontiac Solstice and I had stopped opening emails from the forum site I had listed it on and I believe I must have deleted the last email notifications sent from this site thinking they were from that one? Then after I finally did get around to fixing it and wanted to share the news I couldn't log on. And that's when I went to flashing everybody here with my ungrateful *** that really isn't.
I know this post is so long that the forum's objective of helping Saturn owners find the correct solution to their problem quickly is long gone but this explanation of a confirmed CKP failure is here.
With my Saturn SL1 sohc 4 cyl 5 speed with 235,000 miles that's CKP sensor failed at speed on the highway. That type of failure for this part is out of the norm. Hopefully any Saturn owner willing to read this far already knows the most common way these CKP sensors show there's a problem is by not restarting after being turned off at running temp. Well, I hate to admit it but since mine crapped at speed. I tried to replicate it's failure by driving around close to the house till it crapped out again. That worked the first time, but all that got me was stuck down the street with no one to turn the key. Then with ignition tester in hand, someone to turn the key, and not barefoot this time! I continued my stupidity of thinking it needed to be in motion and drove it up and down the street till I finally got the bright idea to just turn the car off and see if it wouldn't start. So l did, and it didn't. Then with the no spark situation confirmed and parts in hand. We went to digging and had the car back to running for real a few hours later. I've only driven it a few times but it seems like the higher idle problem it seemed to have since it's failure on the highway has cleared up some but it is still there. Scratch that, it's been over 100 miles now. In addition to the CKPS. I also bought another idle air solenoid. (Replaced that when I 1st bought the car in 2013) and gaskets for the EGR, & throttle body. None of these parts have been used yet.
Yes I did let that vehicle sit too long. Main reason was it got demoted from it's top dog highway mileage status. That new Johnny Come Lately is also capable of pulling off 11 second quarter mile G's. (2005 FJR1300)
I waited long enough to be able to really respect SL1's highway mileage cage capabilities though.
You know how it is, sometimes people trying to go fast in their expensive cars in traffic get a little uptight when they get bested by low dollar classics. Especially when the old fart driving one is laughing.
Thanks again for the great info.
All apologies Derf. I never saw your what happened email. Didn't see the other (Not another ungrateful turd?) email either. That's how I would have written it anyway. The reason for no response from this actually grateful turd is I sold our Pontiac Solstice and I had stopped opening emails from the forum site I had listed it on and I believe I must have deleted the last email notifications sent from this site thinking they were from that one? Then after I finally did get around to fixing it and wanted to share the news I couldn't log on. And that's when I went to flashing everybody here with my ungrateful *** that really isn't.
I know this post is so long that the forum's objective of helping Saturn owners find the correct solution to their problem quickly is long gone but this explanation of a confirmed CKP failure is here.
With my Saturn SL1 sohc 4 cyl 5 speed with 235,000 miles that's CKP sensor failed at speed on the highway. That type of failure for this part is out of the norm. Hopefully any Saturn owner willing to read this far already knows the most common way these CKP sensors show there's a problem is by not restarting after being turned off at running temp. Well, I hate to admit it but since mine crapped at speed. I tried to replicate it's failure by driving around close to the house till it crapped out again. That worked the first time, but all that got me was stuck down the street with no one to turn the key. Then with ignition tester in hand, someone to turn the key, and not barefoot this time! I continued my stupidity of thinking it needed to be in motion and drove it up and down the street till I finally got the bright idea to just turn the car off and see if it wouldn't start. So l did, and it didn't. Then with the no spark situation confirmed and parts in hand. We went to digging and had the car back to running for real a few hours later. I've only driven it a few times but it seems like the higher idle problem it seemed to have since it's failure on the highway has cleared up some but it is still there. Scratch that, it's been over 100 miles now. In addition to the CKPS. I also bought another idle air solenoid. (Replaced that when I 1st bought the car in 2013) and gaskets for the EGR, & throttle body. None of these parts have been used yet.
Yes I did let that vehicle sit too long. Main reason was it got demoted from it's top dog highway mileage status. That new Johnny Come Lately is also capable of pulling off 11 second quarter mile G's. (2005 FJR1300)
I waited long enough to be able to really respect SL1's highway mileage cage capabilities though.
You know how it is, sometimes people trying to go fast in their expensive cars in traffic get a little uptight when they get bested by low dollar classics. Especially when the old fart driving one is laughing.
Thanks again for the great info.
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Joined: Apr 2015
Posts: 3,229
From: Willamette Valley, Oregon
Well, I turned 68 last Friday so again I am officially an even older fart! Thank you for coming back around to tell us about your success story. This and the other Saturn forum have been slow lately. Either everyone is busy or the Saturns just keep running like my LW 300 which is about to roll 100k miles for the first time.
We are rolling back into fire season here in the PNW. We have a 200+ acre wildfire about 8.5 miles Southeast of us. They are attacking it with planes and choppers plus lots of brave firefighters on the extremely steep slopes. The winds are going to move this weekend and the humidity is going to drop and bring most of Western Oregon into the high fire danger warning area again. I may go back to 16 on and 8 off over the weekend again. I might be getting too old for this crap.
Thanks for coming back to this forum!
Andy
We are rolling back into fire season here in the PNW. We have a 200+ acre wildfire about 8.5 miles Southeast of us. They are attacking it with planes and choppers plus lots of brave firefighters on the extremely steep slopes. The winds are going to move this weekend and the humidity is going to drop and bring most of Western Oregon into the high fire danger warning area again. I may go back to 16 on and 8 off over the weekend again. I might be getting too old for this crap.
Thanks for coming back to this forum!
Andy
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