Shut off while driving then no start
 

Greetings,

I posted quite a bit on Saturnfans before the demise of the site and am happy to see there is still a place to go for Saturn issues.

Possibly related symptoms started the day before yesterday when my 97 S series was cold and I began driving the transmission began slipping and the engine started revving higher, this went away after 30 seconds or so then all was well after that.

Today when the car was cold the same thing happened then went away after perhaps several minutes before the transmission began behaving normally again.

Tonight I went out and got about a quarter of a mile when the car was again cold and the engine just shut off. Upon turning the key the starter cranked strong but all the normal dash lights that normally come on when turning the key to the start position did not. The only light at all on the dash when cranking the engine is the battery light.

Recently replaced ignition parts (about 3 months ago) ignition switch, neutral start switch, starter, new battery cables, new starter relay, completely cleaned all body ground wires.

If the fuel pump had gone bad the dash lights would still be working, same with the crank sensor, so I'm leaning towards a relay or fuse, perhaps more towards a relay due to the previous days symptoms as fuses just go and am hoping for some guidance where to look first, I haven't pulled codes or checked to see if the other electrical things are still working, I just walked home and intend to go back tomorrow, hopefully with the part that needs replacing to avoid a call to the tow company.

I just walked to the car and this time the dash lights functioned normally when I turned the key, the car cranked strong multiple times without even a hint of starting, time to call a tow truck to have it towed home.

Sorry for not responding sooner.

There are quite a few things that may be responsible for your current situation.
Trying to diagnose with the car on the road is difficult, as some things are most easily done with the car on jack stands.

For the transmission issue, I'd check the level, but that is properly done with the car running......

How's the oil level?

Please read and post the codes or confirm there are not any.

Thanks

Thank You Derf,

When I checked the trans fluid level after experiencing the issues described above it was a pint low and has been since I changed it this last summer, never got around to properly topping it up afterwards. Never had any transmission issues at all in 10+ years of owning this vehicle and it seems extremely unlikely to me that the transmission issues are not in some way related to the part that has failed, although I suppose it is possible.

I checked codes today and there are none, engine still cranks and dash lights are coming on, I suppose that narrows the problem down a bit to something that doesn't throw a code. The oil level is fine, I use a quart every 4-500 miles so check it regularly and change it frequently, car currently has more than 280,000 miles on it if that helps.

Several weeks ago I installed 2 new standard blue streak coils, nothing wrong with the old ones but thought I would do a bit of a tune up and noticed that one of the 4 pieces of metal sticking up on the ICM had some corrosion on it so I used some sand paper to clean that off. I have no idea how to go about checking if that part is good or not.

It will likely be tomorrow sometime before I'm able to get the vehicle home to do more testing, I'm planning to stick a hose in the gas filler tube and listen to see if the fuel pump is activating when I turn the key on, pull a spark plug and with the wire reattached cranking the engine to see if there is a spark, and go from there.

Any other suggestions or should I report back after I do these things with the results?

You need four components for an engine to run. Air, Fuel, Compression and Spark. You need to determine which one is missing.

W all doors closed and the windows up, turn the key to on.

You should hear a faint low pitched hum for 3 seconds, followed by a firm click.

This the fuel pump priming the fuel system. Usually 2 cycles of this are sufficient. The car may not prime after that.

If you don't hear the fuel pump priming, remove the ipjb cover and use the test port to check the fuel pump relay. If no priming, check the fuse for the fuel pump. I think it's in the same panel.

Also do loan a tool at AutoZone or similar for a fuel pressure gauge and test the pressure at the Schrader valve to the driver side of the fuel rail. If you can't get a gauge, cover it with a rag and to press the center and keep your face out of the way.

Sounds like you know how to check for spark.

PUT THE OLD COILS BACK IN. WE KNOW THEY WORKED WHEN YOU REMOVED THEM. ONE LESS VARIABLE.

I'm going to guess that you have good fuel pressure at the rail but no spark.

Crank the engine normally as you would to start the vehicle.
Remove one of the spark plugs and see if you smell gasoline on it. If the answer is no, then you have no spark and no fuel at the injectors and the likely cause is a failed CKP, crankshaft position sensor.

Common failure on these cars. If by putting the original coils back in corrects the functional issue, then I guess we know where that problem is.

I just pulled a plug after cranking and the plug was wet with gas, after cranking with the plug re-attached to the wire the gas smell coming from the open plug cylinder is even stronger so it is definitely getting gas and there is no spark at all.

I have ordered a new CPS anyways as I've never replaced it in the 130K miles I've owned the vehicle, $28 it is money well spent if it prevents me from getting stranded at some future date.

The coils are long gone to the land fill, as I bought the top of the line Standard Blue Streak coils I assumed there would be no reason to keep the old.

Assuming the coils are still good what else could cause the no spark condition?

It's been a while since I worked on one of these and being brain damaged, I don't remember if these cars have an IOD fuse or not. If so, maybe check that? What do you say, derf? You know these cars. Is there an IOD fuse?

New crank sensor is installed an no difference, plenty of gas but no spark. :confused:

Check the plug wires at the connection to the coil pack. If you see ANY green corrosion, just get some new wires and coil pack and try that. You can always try cleaning the connections and check the ground wire on the coil pack, but sometimes you just have to bite the bullet and get new stuff. IDK, just speculating. Not being an ASE mechanic, you don't have to listen to me. I'm just making suggestions.